Bums, hippies and Greenpeace

[cataclyzm]

I don't consider myself better than anyone. I don't compare myself to other people at all - I learned that lesson many years ago.

[Sharon]

I think what people were actually having a go at were the professional beggars who have finely crafted a story to part you with your money.

And there are plenty of them on the streets.

[Fossil]

I think most of us here on this site know the difference between genuine need and the rest who want a bung/donation.
-F-

[cataclyzm]

Sharon,

Please tell me, why were none of these people on the streets when I was younger? Why is it now?
What's changed in our society to make people beg? or to fabricate stories about this 'n that, in order to get money. Society has changed, and yet we blame the people who are its victims. How sad is that?

[kn0wledge]

None of them were on the streets when you were younger because scrounging wasn't an accepted profession, like it is today.

[Fossil]

When you were younger, maybe people didn’t need heroin, hash etc to feed a habit. Maybe they beg now for the little extras to buy trainers, phones etc.

Even addicts and homeless people are consumers

-F-

[evilmiss]

The main thing that angers me, is those who beg-who are in receipt of benefit. I know this through previous employment. The same people who asked me for a pound to get home...the previous day they were sitting in front of my desk- signing on.

Anyhoo...Mr. Fossil, if you want to see the wee wumman selling roses run like the clappers out of a pub, shout, 'She's got a knife!'. Then again, maybe not...

[turbozutek]

Still have not answered Sharon's question Catz.... What puts you at a higher level morally than us ?

Chris...

[Fossil]

-F-

[crusty_bint]

hahahahahaha ...sorry Cataclyzm, I had to larf!

Alright, so maybe there's hardly a minority group not taking a bashing in this thread but the poin being made is against professional begging. Yes its sad that some people have no, or feel they have no choice other than to beg but Glasgow City centre has become a chicken run for the "commercially impoverished"!

I for one am sick of being harrassed at the subway station by "biiii...issshue" and then being threatened when you refuse, only to come out the other end to be confronted by "gonnae tap iz a shnout" or "gonnae geeza draw ay yur shnout" and when the answer they recieve is a polite "no" they're askin to search your pockets!!!

Then there's these Kriskna people... what drugs are they on???? If they sold them in Buchannan St I'd maybe consider stopping to speak to them! At least they're harmless tho! the charities guys are ok tho, jyust draw them a dirty look

[kn0wledge]

My original point was regarding beggars in general; "genuine" and "professional" alike.

This country has the biggest welfare state in the world; there is absolutely no need for bums to be littering our streets, scabby hands outstretched. Anyone who tries to say otherwise is a moronic bleeding-heart liberal who ought to be shot along with those whom they proclaim to defend.

[turbozutek]

I take on board however a lot of what Catz says...

See, homelessness can in fact be rooted in mental disorder.

There was a homeless guy in Kilmarnock call 'John' for a long time, John was setup with a house, fully furnished - bills paid for twelve months and a social worker to come and check on him regularly.

John was back on the streets in a month.

Why ?

Because he felt cooped up and paranoid in the new house. He could hear voices.

Later (After he died) we found out he was in Isla for a long while (An ayrshire asylum) but was punted out when the NHS decided that Asylums were going out of fashion. He was such a part of Kilmarnock that the Killie Standard did a two page spread on his life. Over 150 people turned up for his funeral.

So it seems he wandered the streets with an uncured mental disorder. I wonder if he would have wandered the streets with a broken leg ? Or bleeding wrist ?

Or anything else 'obvious'.

How do I know this you ask ? I talked with him a lot - he lived in Kilmarnock old infirmary (A derelict acute hospital) and I would bump into him often.

To him begging was not a profession - just a way of life. Which is why, remembering him, I find it easy to tell professional beggers and those obviously ripping the p!sh where to go.

Chris...

PS: When you bail out of a house, social worker and support - guess what happens ? That's right; not a penny in benefit!

[cataclyzm]

Well: so now we blame people for having a drug addiction? Whilst the breweries and publicans are definitely not drug pushers are they? They definitely don't feed a habit, and people who smoke are definitely not drug addicts are they?
And yes: I like to have a laugh and enjoy life, but not at the expense of people who for whatever reason have become "victims" of life. Yes, even those drug addicts that people so like to despise were once young children with their whole life in front of them. What interests me is what made them into the people they are now? and can we really condemn for being the way they are?
As for my "Jesus syndrome", yes I did find that funny and can take it on the chin, and do I love and respect Jesus Christ? - Yes, absolutely, Am I religious? No...absolutely not.
People who pock fun at Christ's life, are no different to people who pock fun at "gay" people, what is it they are really frightened of?

[turbozutek]

Oh no...

Catz mentioned Jesus.

As for my "Jesus syndrome", yes I did find that funny and can take it on the chin, and do I love and respect Jesus Christ? - Yes, absolutely, Am I religious? No...absolutely not.

That is a bit of an oxymoron is it not ?

How can you love and respect jesus without religion ?

That's like loving and respecting cinderella without actually believing in fairy stories is it not ?

Chris...

[cataclyzm]

Well: this gets interesting...

the truth is: that established religion actually condemned and crucified Jesus. They saw him as a threat and sought his destruction as they did with John the Baptist.
Jesus represented Love....that is why he was physically a threat to the "religious" representatives of that time and place, for love represents the truth and the truth is a threat to a whole lot of people.
Jesus did not represent any "institution", and he exists in people's hearts, not merely in a religious building.
I don't "believe" this, this is the choice I've made in my life through experience and adversity, and it brings me peace and contentment and an acceptance I could never find in the manufactured world. It is a "reality" in my life, not just a "belief", and I know that I am very far from being "perfect", and neither would I want to be that.
And sometimes in life, the best friendships are made with people we "argue" and can disagree with: so I hope that people don't hate me now for my opinions.