Jobs with Glasgow City Council

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Postby escotregen » Mon Oct 31, 2005 11:27 am

Interesting sideshot on all the above, but I'm not sure what it says exactly :?

For all that I do say that we have to face up to realities in Glasgow, I do get restless at folks who seem to strive to self-denigrate and make everything in Glasgow to be automatically worse than anywhere else.

Anyways, last night I was sitting in the Birmingham Airport departure lounge with a group of equally hung-over delegates from all over the UK (we had been at a week-end conference). One English-accented person in the course of nothing, said to me that 'you do have these really bad problems of violence and religion in Glasgow don't you?' (thanks a million Irvine Welsh for your recent Gruniad article - how to shit on your own folks).

I responded that different cities and communities have different issues. I observed that there we were, in a packed Birmingham airport, very clearly, as white people, in the definite minority. I was then going to on to say that I appreciated this was the period of Ramadan and that major departures were leaving all through this particular period for the Indian sub-continent. Therefore there would naturally be a huge temporary concentration of Asians at this time - but that someone not knowing this might crudely concur with some racist remarks to the effect that 'our cities like Birmingham are being swamped'. Point being that you should not jump to conclusions about whole cities that you know little about.

But as soon as I made my remark about whites being in the minority at the airport, our English-accented friend who made the remark about Glasgow, started railing about me showing all the stereo-typing and prejudice of a racist. The Scots in the company laughed at our English-accented friend... perhaps this was taken as evidence that as Scots we were all innately bigoted :?
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Postby Roxburgh » Mon Oct 31, 2005 2:33 pm

germistonguy wrote:How relevant is the term 'bhoys' to this discussion. The term 'bhoy' conjures up images of Celtic supporting Irishmen/Scottish-'plastic paddys' who are likely to be RC. Would it not be better to omit the term 'jobs for the bhoys', or does the supposed 'nepotism' involve more than religion.


Well you have the example of Alex Mosson abusing his office in order to support Celtic and the "sweetheart" deal by which Kinloch Street, Dalriada Street and Janefield Street were sold to Celtic for a penny.
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Re: Uncomfortable topic for some.

Postby Roxburgh » Mon Oct 31, 2005 2:34 pm

Dexter St. Clair wrote:Naw the use of the term "Bhoys" is deemed to be funnier and less abusive than "Tims" "Taigs" or "Fenians". The phrase is borrowed from WOSIC's who use it to describe themselves.


Many Celtic supporters are happy to call themselves tims. The term comes, apparently, from one Tim Malloy a notorious Glasgow gang leader.
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Postby Vladimir » Mon Oct 31, 2005 2:44 pm

Fenians


A political party... :?
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Postby crusty_bint » Mon Oct 31, 2005 2:46 pm

This discussion is getting abit out of hand and has the definite odour sectarianism laced through it. Perhaps this topic would be best suited to another forum?
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Postby AlanM » Mon Oct 31, 2005 2:56 pm

It does seem to have taken on a life of its own, but I don't think it's crossed the line or even got close to it.

Although I was surprised at the umbridge taken at the 'jobs for the bhoys' remark as it was simply a paraphrasing of 'jobs for the boys' which has more 'establishment' connotations and I felt it fitted the context of the discussion more.

If it caused any offence I apologise

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Postby Roxburgh » Mon Oct 31, 2005 4:05 pm

Most of the comments have been relevant to the original topic. If there is an unpleasant odour of sectarianism its because that odour permeates all the way to the GCC.
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Postby Fat Cat » Mon Oct 31, 2005 4:26 pm

Roxburgh wrote:Most of the comments have been relevant to the original topic. If there is an unpleasant odour of sectarianism its because that odour permeates all the way to the GCC.


It may have been true at one point but not now. Some people on here are just using it as an excuse to spout rubbish.
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Postby Mori » Mon Oct 31, 2005 4:40 pm

GCC obviously know how much sectarianism exists in the city, which is why they are trying to address it, it wont go away overnight, it has been built in to culture for centuries.

http://www.glasgow.gov.uk/en/YourCouncil/PolicyPlanning_Strategy/Corporate/Research_Development/sectarianisminglasgow.htm
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Postby Bex Bissell » Mon Oct 31, 2005 4:48 pm

Roxburgh wrote:
germistonguy wrote:How relevant is the term 'bhoys' to this discussion. The term 'bhoy' conjures up images of Celtic supporting Irishmen/Scottish-'plastic paddys' who are likely to be RC. Would it not be better to omit the term 'jobs for the bhoys', or does the supposed 'nepotism' involve more than religion.


Well you have the example of Alex Mosson abusing his office in order to support Celtic and the "sweetheart" deal by which Kinloch Street, Dalriada Street and Janefield Street were sold to Celtic for a penny.


We must be careful and not jump to conclusions a lot of land in Glasgow that has derelict housing has been sold to Companies for a penny, OK a quid was the figure I know of that was done between a housing developer and GCC.
The benefit of this is that GCC dosnt need to dip into the coffers to build houses all they do is tell the developer that the deal is 20% of all the new houses they build must be for Local Housing Associaitons to rent, also with these new houses for sale then the plan is to tempt people from outside the city eg EK, Greenock, Hamilton to come and live.
How does the Council gain, well easy...Council Tax.
That once run down pit is now a nice new estate with 200 new houses on it with a council tax bill on each of them for around a least £1.5k a year.

Perhaps the plans that Celtic have for the surrounding area are ones of regeneration and growth, far too much for the public purse to fund.
Same with Rangers and the big Casino, how much have they or will they have to pay out in order to aquire the houses/land opposite the main stand?
It'll probably be around the same price.
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Postby crusty_bint » Mon Oct 31, 2005 5:35 pm

Roxburgh wrote:Most of the comments have been relevant to the original topic. If there is an unpleasant odour of sectarianism its because that odour permeates all the way to the GCC.


The topic isn't "How backward is your thinking?".
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Postby Roxburgh » Mon Oct 31, 2005 5:41 pm

In June 1993, the existing stadium at, Celtic park had a certified capacity of 56,000, of which only 12,000 were seated. At that time the board of Celtic had almost decided to relocate to a new purpose built stadium at Camsbuslang. The solution to keeping Celtic in Glasgow was to build over Janefield Street, the public highway and cantilever the rear of the upper tier of seats back out over the cemetery by some 10 meters.

The council houses in Janefield, Kerrydale and Dalriada Streets were demolished and the residents re-housed because the new Stadium blocked out their light and interfered with their TV receptions. Council tax payers footed the bill for this as the land was sold to Celtic Plc for a penny.

The cost to the council in terms of resettlement grants to the 300 or so families living in the houses, the demolition of said houses and ground clearance was conservatively estimated at £1.25 million.

The Legal and Estates Committee comprising thirteen councillors met to approve the sale of ground (the three streets) to Celtic. There were 11 Labour Party councillors, one SNP, and one Tory. Both the Tory and SNP councillors demanded that their fellow councillors in the Committee state their allegiances, shareholding, season ticket status, etc..... The meeting was suspended and the decision on the sale was passed to a full council meeting (all 102 Glasgow District councillors).

All but 11 of those 102 councillors were Labour Party councillors. Those 11 put forward the same motion for disclosure of share holding and season ticket status before the vote was to be taken. The then leader of GDC, Pat Lafferty made the ruling that these details did not have to be revealed. The vote was taken and the full council decided overwhelmingly to sell the land to Celtic for a penny.

ps. This is not a criticism of Celtic. They behaved the way I would expect any company to behave. If you can get the council to help then fair enough.
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Postby Socceroo » Mon Oct 31, 2005 6:09 pm

I think we are getting too wrapped up in prejudice here and taking a totally misguided view on sectarianism within Glasgow City Council.

Yes sectarianism exists in the West of Scotland. It will exist in Glasgow City Council to some extent as it probably does in every other large organisation in the West of Scotland.

However, is the Council sectarian to its core? No way, if it was it would be far more widely reported in the same fashion as the ongoing problem with the Old Firm.

Let's not forget the historical facts that the Council was / has been for many years an organisation in which the Labour Party has held power. Labour at its inception attracted the working class masses, which were on the Clydeside largely made up of Irish immigrants / their descendants who were largely Roman Catholic.

Is the Labour Party a sectarian organisation? I have never heard it reported as such.

The are a lot of things which could be thrown at Glasgow City Council that would stick. I do not think that sectarianism is one of them.

I suppose that this thread is taking such a tangent that we will be discussing RC schools next.

I don't think this forum is really the place to discuss sectarianism.
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Postby crusty_bint » Mon Oct 31, 2005 6:20 pm

Socceroo wrote:I don't think this forum is really the place to discuss sectarianism.


I agree.

For those who have actually put a bit of thought into what they have said on this thread and who wished to debate the Council rather than Celtic I can only apologise for others petty-mindedness.

Thread locked.
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Postby crusty_bint » Tue Nov 01, 2005 11:04 pm

Okay... thread unlocked now guys, try and steer clear of sectarian subject matter ...keep it all relevant :D

Cheers,

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